JPL
Well-known member
Since there are no more aA123 batteries, how about rebuilt using Tesla 2170 battery cells?
Stock coolant?
Any opinions will be really appreciate it
Stock coolant?
Any opinions will be really appreciate it
Future battery replacement
- Thread starter JPL
- Start date
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MrDRMorgan
Well-known member
JPL said:
Sometime in the future, some bright individual will find a way to easily and quickly test and rebuild EV batteries.
JPL
Well-known member
How about the Samsung one:
https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/samsung-30t-21700-tesla-size-battery-cells/22237
https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/samsung-30t-21700-tesla-size-battery-cells/22237
You worry too much... :shock:JPL said:
Plot your degradation.
You have 8yr/100k miles of no worries, correct?
After that, when do you replace the cells in the '14 pack with whatever homebuilt option you can find or just use a '15-16 pack :?:
When it is down to a 50 mile pack? 40, 30?
SparkevBlogspot
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 25, 2015
- Messages
- 498
Grey market would only make sense if it's profitable. Given that there aren't many SparkEV on the road, I don't think there will be many options without costing a bundle. Sure, there might be some rebuilt options from shady shops like my experience with Prius battery, but given that there are far fewer SparkEV than Prius, I doubt there will be many.
As for next-gen technology batteries, the problem is the software. Without the ability to change the code, simply replacing the battery with new tech will not work. Again, there aren't enough SparkEV to justify hacking the software and risking lawsuits from potential problems.
I doubt there will be any grey market options using new cells unless SparkEV becomes collector's car. So far, there's no sign that it will be collector's car, which means dead battery is pretty much junk car.
As for next-gen technology batteries, the problem is the software. Without the ability to change the code, simply replacing the battery with new tech will not work. Again, there aren't enough SparkEV to justify hacking the software and risking lawsuits from potential problems.
I doubt there will be any grey market options using new cells unless SparkEV becomes collector's car. So far, there's no sign that it will be collector's car, which means dead battery is pretty much junk car.
sTeeve
Well-known member
SparkevBlogspot said:
Have to agree. It's a "disposable" car.
SparkevBlogspot said:
While you are almost undoubtedly correct that the Spark's lifespan coincides with the death of the battery, I have to say that I had very good results with a rebuilt Prius battery (GreenTecAuto). Interestingly they don't do Volt batteries, NiMH might be easier to work with than Lithium.
Sad, as the Spark is such a kick in in the pants to drive.
MrDRMorgan
Well-known member
sTeeve said:
Actually, this could be great news to some. Find a nice low-mileage used Spark EV and drive it until it quits. Then, recycle the battery and part-out or scrap the rest. This might be much cheaper than paying for a new car / depreciation. There are a lot of nice used 2014 Spark EVs out there just waiting for some TLC. A Spark EV cannot be beat for in-town driving - DCFC is not needed.
JPL
Well-known member
Oh yeah I would prefer bolt cells!
BEEMAN
Member
if you have a 2015 Spark EV you have the 2.6 chemistry which was a bridge between the cells uses in a Volt Gen 1 and a Volt Gen 2. If you have a 2016 Spark EV you have the same cells from a 2016 2nd Gen Volt. The Spark EV is my favorite EV of the first generation. I work with many EVs and the LG cells are excellent. They hold up well over time.
SparkevBlogspot
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 25, 2015
- Messages
- 498
You may not like Bolt cells. Bolt at over 3X SparkEV battery tapers DCFC to only 36 kW (0.6C) at around 50% charge, and 25 kW (0.4C) at 70%. By comparison, SparkEV charges at 48 kW (2.7C, 300% to 650% quicker) all the way to 80%, and replacing SparkEV cells with Bolt cells will result in slower charging.JPL said:
In addition, Bolt is only 200 kW power (150% more than SparkEV) using 60 kWh (320% more than SparkEV). It's not clear if the output power limit is the battery or the motor, but it is possible that Bolt cells can't provide as much power as SparkEV cells. If that's the case, SparkEV with Bolt cells will result in slower acceleration.
As far as EV's go, SparkEV is truly a revolutionary car unlike anything on the market in many metrics. There's no EV that can charge as quick as SparkEV and very tall gear ratio (huge torque). It's also the most efficient production car ever created (though IoniqEV may rival it; not enough data on Ioniq, yet). It will be some time before other EV catch up to SparkEV. In that regard, it's pretty hard to make SparkEV "better" by using parts from other EV.
Glad to hear from you and your insider info !!!!! Seriously !BEEMAN said:
I plan on keeping my '14 until it's <30 mile EV, and then ????
It seems the '14 and the Bolt share the 'Plate' type of TMS for the cells. This should make MacGyvering in new, different cells easier, I would think.
Stack the replacement cells in the old pack, make the series power connections, attach the original BMS wires, strap it all down securely and Bob's your Uncle !!
Sounds easy to me... :roll: :lol:
JPL
Well-known member
https://electrek.co/2017/01/17/clas...esla-electric-motor-kia-soul-ev-battery-pack/
Looks like the kia soul EV have the best batteries of all
Looks like the kia soul EV have the best batteries of all
? Do you see that battery pack hanging there? Do you see those TMS coolant hoses to cool and heat the cells as required? NO. That's not very High Tech.JPL said:
Cells are cells. Without some sort of BMS to limit current sucked out of a pack, you can flog any pack of cells really hard, if you want to and don't care about pack life.
Look at how the RC guys use, and use up, their Li-ion packs.
Kia talks about their "Heat Recovery" system. So low tech and seemingly unsafe to me. Look it up.
I am not counting on companies that will be able to produce aftermarket batteries, but I wouldn't be surprised at all. A small market won't necessarily be a problem either. 8-10 years is a very long time in technology.
A well built pack will not need any hacking of the software, even if it is bigger. All they would need to know is what control signals to send. As long as they have the right control signals, and output is within range of acceptable, the car can be fooled into believing it has nothing but a standard battery.
As for having a larger battery, as long as it was built in multiples of original spec, it could be set up to act as multiple independent battery packs, one turning off and the next coming online as the previous pack drains. You might need to add a custom BMS to the packs, but that would be very simple.
As for small market, we are not that far away from computers being able to design a cell holding pack on their own simply by putting in a set of variables (dimensions, etc...) and then having it printed out. In 8 years we may very well be there. The idea that a company needs to gear up and retool for something like that is going to be an obsolete idea in the very near future. Heck, even doing a one off won't be much more costly than the materials themselves.
A well built pack will not need any hacking of the software, even if it is bigger. All they would need to know is what control signals to send. As long as they have the right control signals, and output is within range of acceptable, the car can be fooled into believing it has nothing but a standard battery.
As for having a larger battery, as long as it was built in multiples of original spec, it could be set up to act as multiple independent battery packs, one turning off and the next coming online as the previous pack drains. You might need to add a custom BMS to the packs, but that would be very simple.
As for small market, we are not that far away from computers being able to design a cell holding pack on their own simply by putting in a set of variables (dimensions, etc...) and then having it printed out. In 8 years we may very well be there. The idea that a company needs to gear up and retool for something like that is going to be an obsolete idea in the very near future. Heck, even doing a one off won't be much more costly than the materials themselves.
