2015 Spark no longer 21-kWh and now 19 ???

[TonyWilliams]

I'd rather they kept the battery the same physical size and upped the wattage. Range is good, more range is better.

Clearly, you don't understand the reason for the car then. It's not to provide you with "more range".

The target is 100 miles of range to get 3 CARB-ZEV credits. To get 1 more credit requires 200 miles of range, which is why there are exactly ZERO compliance cars with 200 mile range. It would require more the double the very expensive battery to only get 25% more credit. It's better to use the same amount of total battery to make two cars for 6 credits.

GM blew it by having a car that would go "too far", because the threshold everybody uses is the EPA "city cycle" at 19.59mph average to determine that 100 miles. The current Spark EV would blow through 100 miles easily (it almost does 100 miles at 62mph/100kmh).

So, you'll get a smaller,cheaper battery and the usual BS from GM that "all is well".

 

[TonyWilliams]

Ok, seems people can't seem to stay on topic !

People, MAKE YOUR OWN TOPIC !

Mods, can you just delete this whole topic ??

Maybe they have put me on Ignore and can't see what I write. Maybe I should just do that same :roll:

You don't suppose that there's a teeny tiny chance that we are tired of reading YOUR off-topic rants?

Just report any posts you feel do not meet the forum rules by clicking the icon (red exclamation mark) in the lower right hand side of each offending post. The moderators can handle the rest.

 

[TonyWilliams]

<SNIP!>

I deleted a bunch of inflammatory posts on all sides here. Let's keep the conversation on-topic.

Thank you. For the record, you're welcome to browse the www.MyRav4EV.com forum that I moderate (same forum owner, same software) and you'll note that there isn't a SINGLE post with trash talk, f-bombs, personal attacks, politics, sex, or religion. Not one.

Anybody who would engage in this would be warned the first time (and the post edited or deleted to reflect the terms of agreement of use), the second time they would be put on the beach for a period of time, and the third time is a permanent IP ban and User name ban.

When they pop back up as another name in a hours to a few days later (they almost always do), that IP and User name is immediately banned.

Food for thought.

 

[nozferatu]

Given the number of times the media and "scientists have been caught slanting data to support " global warming". There is too much blind faith in the cult of global warming. Slanting the numbers or picking and choosing only the data that supports the theory does occur. Some folk turn a blind eye as they figure "the end justifies the means".
Some people have become very wealthy via promoting and taking advantage of a "green" agenda.
It's a real temptation to get on a power trip with a cause that can not be questioned such as "save the earth". Some folk like playing the martyr role and "do with out" to "save the earth" . There is even a small cult of people in western civilization . That make a point of "saving the world" by not owning a fridge or freezer. They are not Amish either.

Planet earth has undergone countless temperature swings before mankind had any influence. There are frozen buried jungles in arctic regions. There is also evidence of ice age glaciers being halfway across continental USA.
Earth's source of heat is the sun. If anybody hasn't noticed. The sun has several short and long term cycles in which it's output significantly changes.

Facts are facts...cults are different. Most scientists aren't of the ilk you speak of and having been in the climate science and engineering industry, I can assure you our effect on the planet is real, concern is warranted, and the direction we are going in is not a good one. I don't believe in doomsday scenarios as far as climate goes but it won't take much to destroy the very delicate balance of life we now enjoy (harvests, ocean life, etc). A few bad years and millions of people will be in trouble.

The planet has gone through many changes but the rates of change have been slow. Nothing in recorded or date history has ever caused such an equivalent rapid rise in CO2 density in such a short period of time as we have seen in the last 250 years or less...coinciding directly with the industrial age and high emissions.

What we are seeing now is the Earth trying to adapt to the high concentrations of CO2 that we have put into the atmosphere....a stable system that has been disrupted by a large input. We will see the oceans absorbing much of it...acidifying the oceans. We will see temperature extremes....areas getting warmer and areas getting cooler. The system is a feedback system and has the possibility of going unstable or settling to a new stable point...one which isn't favoured by us for a good quality of life.

So far the power trips of corporations and companies to trash the planet has far outpaced any power trip from any green movement. So let's not overhype the green peoples' impacts as something it isn't.

http://climate.nasa.gov/key_indicators

http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence

 

[seanrarey]

It is quite disappointing to click on a topic that is labeled such that one is led to believe it contains a discussion regarding pack capacity; only to find the drivel the past 9 pages contain.

Gentlemen, a constant on this board seems to be Mr. Williams swooping into a topic to say something inflammatory, and completely derailing the intended discussion. I challenge you, my fellow GM EV lovers to not bite on bait meant to disparage, disrupt and diminish the productive sharing of information in this, _our_ forum.

He craves the engagement you give him; so that he may lord his superiorness over you poor non-Nissan-driving slobs. Knowing this, don't feed him. Whereas this forum does not have the useful "Ignore User" feature seen on some, with some self-restraint I trust we all can simply look at the name of the poster, and if that name contains "Williams", move past the post to something constructive.

Sean Rarey
Grants Pass Electric Vehicles

 

[iletric]

Well said...

 

[gra]

This forum like most has a 'Foes' list, accessible from the User Control Panel. If you wish not to see posts from a particular member, then just put them on your 'Foes' list.

 

[emv]

I'd rather they kept the battery the same physical size and upped the wattage. Range is good, more range is better.

Clearly, you don't understand the reason for the car then. It's not to provide you with "more range".

The target is 100 miles of range to get 3 CARB-ZEV credits. To get 1 more credit requires 200 miles of range, which is why there are exactly ZERO compliance cars with 200 mile range. It would require more the double the very expensive battery to only get 25% more credit. It's better to use the same amount of total battery to make two cars for 6 credits.

GM blew it by having a car that would go "too far", because the threshold everybody uses is the EPA "city cycle" at 19.59mph average to determine that 100 miles. The current Spark EV would blow through 100 miles easily (it almost does 100 miles at 62mph/100kmh).

So, you'll get a smaller,cheaper battery and the usual BS from GM that "all is well".

Thank you so very much Tony. I was really looking forward to one of your trademark lectures to let yet another simpleton like myself know how smart you are. I now realize that I was completely out of line for posting on topic and expressing my opinion, based on actual Spark EV ownership, on what I would have preferred GM do - regardless of the likelihood of them doing it. I stand humbled before you. Perhaps I should forward all future posts to you so as to solicit your approval thereby not showing my ignorance/stupidity.

 

[TonyWilliams]

This forum like most has a 'Foes' list, accessible from the User Control Panel. If you wish not to see posts from a particular member, then just put them on your 'Foes' list.

Exactly. All the "I hate Tony Williams" posts doesn't accomplish anything but distract from the thread and the forum. Perhaps it makes some of you feel good.

If my message (or anybody else's) isn't one you want read, put me or that person on your "Foes List".


You don't suppose that there's a teeny tiny chance that we are tired of reading YOUR off-topic rants?

Just report any posts you feel do not meet the forum rules by clicking the icon (red exclamation mark) in the lower right hand side of each offending post. The moderators can handle the rest.

Ok, seems people can't seem to stay on topic !

People, MAKE YOUR OWN TOPIC !

Mods, can you just delete this whole topic ??

Maybe they have put me on Ignore and can't see what I write. Maybe I should just do that same :roll:

Thank you so very much Tony. I was really looking forward to one of your trademark lectures to let yet another simpleton like myself know how smart you are. I now realize that I was completely out of line for posting on topic and expressing my opinion, based on actual Spark EV ownership, on what I would have preferred GM do - regardless of the likelihood of them doing it. I stand humbled before you. Perhaps I should forward all future posts to you so as to solicit your approval thereby not showing my ignorance/stupidity.

It is quite disappointing to click on a topic that is labeled such that one is led to believe it contains a discussion regarding pack capacity; only to find the drivel the past 9 pages contain.

Gentlemen, a constant on this board seems to be Mr. Williams swooping into a topic to say something inflammatory, and completely derailing the intended discussion. I challenge you, my fellow GM EV lovers to not bite on bait meant to disparage, disrupt and diminish the productive sharing of information in this, _our_ forum.

He craves the engagement you give him; so that he may lord his superiorness over you poor non-Nissan-driving slobs. Knowing this, don't feed him. Whereas this forum does not have the useful "Ignore User" feature seen on some, with some self-restraint I trust we all can simply look at the name of the poster, and if that name contains "Williams", move past the post to something constructive.

Sean Rarey
Grants Pass Electric Vehicles

Well said...

 

[nozferatu]

This forum like most has a 'Foes' list, accessible from the User Control Panel. If you wish not to see posts from a particular member, then just put them on your 'Foes' list.

Exactly. All the "I hate Tony Williams" doesn't add to anything.

Sadly intelligence without humility doesn't mean anything either.

 

[TonyWilliams]

This forum like most has a 'Foes' list, accessible from the User Control Panel. If you wish not to see posts from a particular member, then just put them on your 'Foes' list.

Exactly. All the "I hate Tony Williams" doesn't add to anything.

Sadly intelligence without humility doesn't mean anything either.

Listen, this forum needs real moderation. That's a fact. Please, PLEASE, for all the "I hate Tony Williams" posters,

DO US ALL A HUGE FAVOR AND PUT ME ON YOUR FOE LIST NOW.

If a post doesn't meet the "terms of agreement" for the forum, REPORT IT.

This is simple stuff, folks.

Tony

<SNIP!>

I deleted a bunch of inflammatory posts on all sides here. Let's keep the conversation on-topic.

Thank you. For the record, you're welcome to browse the http://www.MyRav4EV.com forum that I moderate (same forum owner, same software) and you'll note that there isn't a SINGLE post with trash talk, f-bombs, personal attacks, politics, sex, or religion. Not one.

Anybody who would engage in this would be warned the first time (and the post edited or deleted to reflect the terms of agreement of use), the second time they would be put on the beach for a period of time, and the third time is a permanent IP ban and User name ban.

When they pop back up as another name in a hours to a few days later (they almost always do), that IP and User name is immediately banned.

Food for thought.

 

[nozferatu]

Yes I agree...they do need real moderation. That is why you need to stop your belittling and demeaning of people here. That has to stop. That sort of behavior is totally unwelcome from you or anyone else.

No one needs to get publicly available information from someone who behaves like you. There's no excuse for your behavior. If you want to act this way, feel to do so at your Rav4 forum where you can feel like the king of the hill banning people who don't agree with you.

Cheers

 

[TonyWilliams]

Yes I agree...they do need real moderation. That is why you need to stop your belittling and demeaning of people here. That has to stop. That sort of behavior is totally unwelcome from you or anyone else.

No one needs to get publicly available information from someone who behaves like you. There's no excuse for your behavior. If you want to act this way, feel to do so at your Rav4 forum where you can feel like the king of the hill banning people who don't agree with you.

Cheers

And that's what you don't get. Nobody is banned for not agreeing with another poster. There are banned for not following the basic and simple terms of agreement and general decorum.

You, sir, are out of control. I absolutely would have tossed your butt to the kiddy pool for the multitude of personal attacks, language, and just generally being a complete tool. None of that has any bearing whatsoever on what you think about any topic; your personal opinion within the terms of agreement is free to express.

We will get this fixed, that I absolutely guarantee.

Tony

 

[nozferatu]

Yes I agree...they do need real moderation. That is why you need to stop your belittling and demeaning of people here. That has to stop. That sort of behavior is totally unwelcome from you or anyone else.

No one needs to get publicly available information from someone who behaves like you. There's no excuse for your behavior. If you want to act this way, feel to do so at your Rav4 forum where you can feel like the king of the hill banning people who don't agree with you.

Cheers

And that's what you don't get. Nobody is banned for not agreeing with another poster. There are banned for not following the basic and simple terms of agreement and general decorum.

You, sir, are out of control. I absolutely would have tossed your butt to the kiddy pool for the multitude of personal attacks, language, and just generally being a complete tool.

We will get this fixed, that I absolutely guarantee.

Tony

NO I do get it. I don't think it's OUR job as members of this forum to put up with your nonsense. You have overstepped your boundaries in this forum with your disrespect and dispolite behavior so it's NOT my job to ban you or put the effort into banning you or putting you on some "foe" list.

What you don't get is no one wants behavior like yours around here....do you understand that? It's spelled out as clear as day. Either act like a civil person or leave. Disagreeing isn't the issue...your bad behavior and sour attitude is.

Yes I hope we do get this fixed...I'm sure many people will be very pleased if you fixed your attitude or if not just left.

Cheers

 

[TonyWilliams]

NO I do get it. I don't think it's OUR job as members of this forum to put up with your nonsense. You have overstepped your boundaries in this forum with your disrespect and dispolite behavior so it's NOT my job to ban you or put the effort into banning you or putting you on some "foe" list.

Yes, the moderation of the forum should be sufficient. It's not, by the simple fact that you're still here.

What you don't get is no one wants behavior like yours around here....do you understand that? It's spelled out as clear as day. Either act like a civil person or leave. Disagreeing isn't the issue...your bad behavior and sour attitude is.

Yes, we mutually agree. Please, PLEASE, spare us with your "I hate Tony Williams" posts, and instead,

DO US ALL A HUGE FAVOR AND PUT ME ON YOUR FOE LIST NOW.

If a post doesn't meet the "terms of agreement" for the forum, REPORT that post.

This is simple stuff.

Yes I hope we do get this fixed...I'm sure many people will be very pleased if you fixed your attitude or if not just left.

I'll never be bullied anywhere, bucko. You and you Nazi buddies already have tried that. But, we will fix the problem.

 

[buickanddeere]

Given the number of times the media and "scientists have been caught slanting data to support " global warming". There is too much blind faith in the cult of global warming. Slanting the numbers or picking and choosing only the data that supports the theory does occur. Some folk turn a blind eye as they figure "the end justifies the means".
Some people have become very wealthy via promoting and taking advantage of a "green" agenda.
It's a real temptation to get on a power trip with a cause that can not be questioned such as "save the earth". Some folk like playing the martyr role and "do with out" to "save the earth" . There is even a small cult of people in western civilization . That make a point of "saving the world" by not owning a fridge or freezer. They are not Amish either.

Planet earth has undergone countless temperature swings before mankind had any influence. There are frozen buried jungles in arctic regions. There is also evidence of ice age glaciers being halfway across continental USA.
Earth's source of heat is the sun. If anybody hasn't noticed. The sun has several short and long term cycles in which it's output significantly changes.

Facts are facts...cults are different. Most scientists aren't of the ilk you speak of and having been in the climate science and engineering industry, I can assure you our effect on the planet is real, concern is warranted, and the direction we are going in is not a good one. I don't believe in doomsday scenarios as far as climate goes but it won't take much to destroy the very delicate balance of life we now enjoy (harvests, ocean life, etc). A few bad years and millions of people will be in trouble.

The planet has gone through many changes but the rates of change have been slow. Nothing in recorded or date history has ever caused such an equivalent rapid rise in CO2 density in such a short period of time as we have seen in the last 250 years or less...coinciding directly with the industrial age and high emissions.

What we are seeing now is the Earth trying to adapt to the high concentrations of CO2 that we have put into the atmosphere....a stable system that has been disrupted by a large input. We will see the oceans absorbing much of it...acidifying the oceans. We will see temperature extremes....areas getting warmer and areas getting cooler. The system is a feedback system and has the possibility of going unstable or settling to a new stable point...one which isn't favoured by us for a good quality of life.

So far the power trips of corporations and companies to trash the planet has far outpaced any power trip from any green movement. So let's not overhype the green peoples' impacts as something it isn't.

http://climate.nasa.gov/key_indicators

http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence

I burned a record amount of firewood 2013-2014 to keep warm during our longest and coldest winter in decades.
CO2 doesn't mean beans in the grand scheme of things. There are several other gasses being vented one way or another into the atmosphere. Just how exactly we are going to stop methane from rising for the ground and vented from various animal or insect hind parts? Then my favourite, the volcano. Ever see the troubling figures on what those natural phenomena spew ? At least one earth wide mass extinction in the past was due to volcanoes, no humans involved.
There are wooly mammoths in the Arctic deceased from something that killed them quick. Some still have the grass in their mouths they were chewing when struck down.
The USB fob saved more trees than any greenpeacer ever did.

 

[TonyWilliams]

At least one earth wide mass extinction in the past was due to volcanoes, no humans involved.
The USB fob saved more trees than any greenpeacer ever did.

I don't find the usual climate denier arguments believable, but I fully agree that natural phenomena can and does affect climate, just as we humans are affecting climate with dumping CO2 into the atmosphere that has been sequestered for millions of years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1883_eruption_of_Krakatoa

The final explosive eruption of volcano Krakatoa was heard 3,000 miles away; caused at least 36,417 deaths; 20 million tons of sulfur released into the atmosphere; produced a volcanic winter (reducing worldwide temperatures by an average of 1.2°C for 5 years); and was the loudest explosion in recorded history.

Global climate[edit]
In the year following the eruption, average Northern Hemisphere summer temperatures fell by as much as 1.2 °C (2.2 °F).[9] Weather patterns continued to be chaotic for years, and temperatures did not return to normal until 1888.[9] The record rainfall that hit Southern California during the “water year” from July 1883 to June 1884 – Los Angeles received 38.18 inches (969.8 mm) and San Diego 25.97 inches (659.6 mm)[10] – has been attributed to the Krakatoa eruption.[11] There was no El Niño during that period as is normal when heavy rain occurs in Southern California,[12] but many scientists doubt this proposed causal relationship.[13]

The eruption injected an unusually large amount of sulfur dioxide (SO2) gas high into the stratosphere, which was subsequently transported by high level winds all over the planet. This led to a global increase in sulfuric acid (H2SO4) concentration in high level cirrus clouds. The resulting increase in cloud reflectivity (or albedo) would reflect more incoming light from the sun than usual, and cool the entire planet until the suspended sulfur fell to the ground as acid precipitation.[14]

Global optical effects[edit]
The eruption darkened the sky worldwide for years afterward, and produced spectacular sunsets throughout the world for many months. British artist William Ashcroft made thousands of colour sketches of the red sunsets half way around the world from Krakatoa in the years after the eruption. The ash caused "such vivid red sunsets that fire engines were called out in New York, Poughkeepsie, and New Haven to quench the apparent conflagration."[15] This eruption also produced a Bishop's Ring around the sun by day, and a volcanic purple light at twilight.

 

[nmikmik]

Would anyone mind if we move the climate related post to this, hopefully appropriately located thread?
http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3807

 

[nozferatu]

I'll never be bullied anywhere, bucko. You and you Nazi buddies already have tried that. But, we will fix the problem.

Just take your arrogance elsewhere please. We've all had enough.

 

[nozferatu]

I burned a record amount of firewood 2013-2014 to keep warm during our longest and coldest winter in decades.
CO2 doesn't mean beans in the grand scheme of things. There are several other gasses being vented one way or another into the atmosphere. Just how exactly we are going to stop methane from rising for the ground and vented from various animal or insect hind parts? Then my favourite, the volcano. Ever see the troubling figures on what those natural phenomena spew ? At least one earth wide mass extinction in the past was due to volcanoes, no humans involved.
There are wooly mammoths in the Arctic deceased from something that killed them quick. Some still have the grass in their mouths they were chewing when struck down.
The USB fob saved more trees than any greenpeacer ever did.

I guess people will justify anything to not admit a problem. That's the way the world works.