First (and only) Failure @ 54k miles.

[NORTON]

Same problem on 2014 spark EV with 55k miles ....replaced 12 battery and all is well now. Just bought one at Walmart to 49.00

Just to be clear my '14 had nothing wrong with its 4 year old AGM battery. It passed a Capacity Check in flying colors!

My car had the HPCM2 go bad after a 9 minute DCFC pit stop. I'm now nervous about doing the next DCFC.

And it turns out this Module can be bought online for $236. It is common with the Volt and Bolt.
Programming it to tell it is in a '14 Spark EV is another matter....

 

[SparkE]

Well, until the car hits 8 years or 100,000 miles, it gets replaced for free under warranty ...

 

[NORTON]

:mrgreen: What a great warranty !! :!:

 

[NORTON]

After the HPCM2 warranty replacement and the 'Range Estimate...' recall my car is strangely Better Than Ever!

The displayed battery capacity is now in the 18 - 20 kWh range.
So far this is from only ~50 mile round trip commutes and only charging in the morning at work.

Before repairs:
mileage date Displayed - Calculated kWh
42110 10-11-17 80% 13.4 -16.75
42366 10-17-17 55% 9.3 -16.91
42416 10-18-17 58% 9.8 -16.90
42480 10-19-17 85% 14.4 -16.94
42654 10-24-17 69% 11.6 -16.81

After repairs:
mileage date Displayed - Calc kWh
54750 7-24-18 58% 11.5 -19.83
54861 7-26-18 60% 11.2 -18.67
55042 7-31-18 54% 10.5 -19.44
55138 8-2-18 54% 10.8 -20.00
55187 8-3-18 55% 11.0 -20.00

WTH is going on here?
Did they slip me a new battery pack?
Will I need to take the car into a deeper discharge to let it know how things are?
I plan on a long night out on the town this evening just to test this theory out.

 

[TheLondonBroiler]

After the HPCM2 warranty replacement and the 'Range Estimate...' recall my car is strangely Better Than Ever!

The displayed battery capacity is now in the 18 - 20 kWh range.

WTH is going on here?

My guess, "Phantom Capacity"

Much like a Nissan LEAF that's been "reset" or possibly even just without 12v power for an extended period, the Spark doesn't know any better.....yet. This will very likely correct itself.

https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=22646
(EDITED TO ADD LINK)

This is a case where I'd be happy to be wrong, but I doubt it.

 

[charles]

I'm generally an optimist, so maybe it is a firmware tweak that really does allow us to use more of the battery before it hits no-go zero. Or it may raise the usable ceiling of what a full charge really can accept. Or better yet, both! Perhaps a 10% buffer was engineered in on both ends, and it has been deemed that a 5% buffer is enough. Perhaps it depends more on climate than it used to.

Or if you are a pessimist, it sounds like a firmware update tweaked to make sure there are fewer warranty claims on batteries come 7 years 11 months or 99k miles.

Just as I've never run out of gas since age 18 (it did happen once in my first 1968 Cutlass S convertible, I learned the hard way), I've never run out of electrons in my Spark, so I don't really know what zero is, and don't want to find out.

 

[NORTON]

WTH :?: - Continued:

Mileage - date - Displayed - Calc kWh
55138 8-2-18 54% 10.8 20.00
55187 8-3-18 55% 11 20.00
55255 8-3-18 80% 14.9 18.63
55320 8-6-18 69% 13.7 19.86

When does the 'Relearn' happen? :lol:

Just for reference, here's some old data:

26713 11-10-16 76% 13.5 17.76
26765 11-11-16 67% 12 17.91
26846 11-14-16 62% 11.3 18.23
26934 11-15-16 27% 4.8 17.78
26958 11-16-16 69% 12.3 17.83
27019 11-17-16 81% 14.5 17.90
27078 11-18-16 76% 13.5 17.76
27078 11-18-16 76% 13.5 17.76
27149 11-19-16 68% 12.5 18.38
27159 11-19-16 81% 14.7 18.15
27159 11-19-16 68% 12.5 18.38
27159 11-19-16 81% 14.7 18.15
27203 11-21-16 62% 11.3 18.23
27203 11-21-16 62% 11.3 18.23
27254 11-22-16 72% 12.8 17.78

 

[SparkE]

When does the 'Relearn' happen? :lol:

Some day when you know you won't have a *need* for range, run the battery down to 10 miles shown range, then calculate, then fully charge. (As it stands, it looks like my next Spark will have "a problem" requiring the same replacement part that you got )

 

[NORTON]

Some day when you know you won't have a *need* for range, run the battery down to 10 miles shown range, then calculate, then fully charge. (As it stands, it looks like my next Spark will have "a problem" requiring the same replacement part that you got )

This run of 80% usage was after 68 miles, and displayed 16 mi range remaining. 84 mi total, if you can believe it...
Mileage - date - Displayed - Calc kWh
55255 8-3-18 80% 14.9 18.63

I don't know if it was the new HPCM2 module or the new SW loaded for the "Range Estimation may be incorrect..." recall.

Somehow my Spark EV has a new "lease on life", even though I own now! Paid off !

 

[PhilPen]

It would be nice to think that was a real value and that the software de-rates it with time like a HP ink cartridge regardless of its real remaining capacity, and after the update it is actually showing what you really have left. I'll take my car in for the update soon, I have 25 kmiles on a 2015 and I'll see what happens to the capacity reading on mine. I was reluctant to take it in because the GOM seemed to show no anomalous behavior at least here in the CT climate and I didn't want them to zero out my accumulate average miles/Kwh... my wife is pulling away from me there as it is.

 

[NORTON]

.... I was reluctant to take it in because the GOM seemed to show no anomalous behavior at least here in the CT climate and I didn't want them to zero out my accumulate average miles/Kwh... my wife is pulling away from me there as it is.

I was also reluctant to have the recall done, but since it was in the shop I had them do it so they don't have anything to lecture me about.

So you and your wife are racing to the bottom? But why? All you have to do is drive really slow....
Do you have Prius owners passing you giving you the finger? :lol:

Here is a copy of the spread sheet I use to log "The Dreaded Battery Degradation".
You need to start now to see if things are different after the recall SW update. I take 3 pics at shut down when >50% charge was used.
Then on a boring day I'll do data entry....

EDIT: Sorry, need to find a better way to share this thing....

Note:
It needs the '%' sign after the number you enter for '% Used'. Sometimes it does it automatically.
% of original Capacity is based on 19.5 kWh. (Can't remember where I finally found that...)

 

[PhilPen]

Thanks for the spread sheet. I work as a teacher and during most of the year (except for summer) I drive the car to about 70-85% discharge every work day 72 mile round commute (my wife has a shorter 55 mile commute 50-65% discharge each day). We do Jekyll and Hyde driving (particularly me during the winter) on the commute we drive conservatively for range but at the weekend the traction control light get to blink and the Prius guys have to use their finger for a different reason. My battery capacity measurements to date have been sporadic I started with reading around 17.2 -17.6 (when I first got the car new) and now at 25 kmiles I'm getting 16.5-16.8. Both cars have DCFC but neither of us have ever used anything except level 2 charging so the batteries have been babied in that regard.

 

[NORTON]

Thanks for the spread sheet.....

Is this spreadsheet working for others?

I tried opening the link and it gave some 'trash' msg, but when I got past that the spreadsheet works !

It is does the calculations when you put in displayed % used and kWh used. Just press enter with each input.

I hope others start using and posting results here , just so we know if our cars are acting normal

 

[NORTON]

My car is still displaying nice and big numbers for range after a charge!

As for my dealer testing my 12 V battery (with a loose post clamp) and telling me it is dying soon,,, well.
I gave it an aviation Capacity Test and it was in great shape.
While I was testing it I used this for a few days, which turned into over 3 weeks:

I see no reason to have a big expensive battery in this car, unless, you routinely leave it parked for 2-3 weeks at a time, then maybe the cell phone and key fob receivers might bring it down.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'll be putting the stock 4 year old battery back in soon,, some weekend.... And I will need this motorcycle battery soon in my Triumph Daytona.

 

[MrDRMorgan]

My car is still displaying nice and big numbers for range after a charge!

As for my dealer testing my 12 V battery (with a loose post clamp) and telling me it is dying soon,,, well.
I gave it an aviation Capacity Test and it was in great shape.
While I was testing it I used this for a few days, which turned into over 3 weeks:

I see no reason to have a big expensive battery in this car, unless, you routinely leave it parked for 2-3 weeks at a time, then maybe the cell phone and key fob receivers might bring it down.

Gotta love creative engineering! :lol:

 

[NORTON]

BAD UPDATE:
It's not funny the second time.

I did the same exact early morning airport run I did a month ago, dropping off the GF at the airport then stopped at a DCFC for an ~8 minute pit stop.
Tap the CP card to start the DCFC.
Tap the CP card to stop the charge when I had about a 15 mile buffer to my work, about 70% SOC.
Got back in the car.
Powered up, released E-brake, selected D and NO GO PEDAL response.
WTH, Over?

Called Onstar and had it towed to the exact same dealer.
I called Onstar while waiting for the tow truck to get CEL code but was given some run around and the truck arrived so I hung up.

Also, this time it does this funny power up on its own after you power it down. The second time it stays powered down. The service writer witnessed this

SIDE NOTE:
I still had the 12V motorcycle battery installed.
So after the shuttle guy dropped me off at home, I grabbed the original battery and parked my Element in front of my dead Spark EV and did a quick switch-a-roo with the batteries! .... That was close.... :lol: :roll:

Wish me luck.
This needs to escalate beyond the local tech and get the mother ship involved.
I know when I get it back this time I will go directly to the closest DCFC unit and repeat the same routine. All the DCFC units in town are the same brand.

 

[TheLondonBroiler]

I always keep my obd2 bluetooth adapter plugged in and can read trouble codes via Torque (although its primary use now is to look at other vehicle data) . You may want to consider doing the same (you can even do this with the free torque lite app).

I hope this gets resolved sooner than later, and look forward to hearing about the fix.

 

[NORTON]

I have Torque Pro and used it on my Volt but never got the two different OBS2/BT adapters that I have to talk to the car and play nice.
I have to figure out how to get the pids into my phone also.... :|

I really want to see all the data that you guys are getting!!

Geez, the title of this thread is now wrong....

 

[NORTON]

UPDATE:

It appears the state of the art trouble shooting is to tell the customer they want to 'Try' an airbag module replacement this time,
even though it is not part of the Power Train, it can take out the Power Train and they charge the customer $800 even if it does not fix the problem.

There is a 2 yr. warranty on this airbag module but the service manager is being cagey about if it goes bad immediately the next time the car is charge at a DCFC unit will it be covered.

And then if it goes bad what's the next part they want to throw at it.
They tell me 'This is at the top of the 'Trouble Tree' and we don't have a next step'....

And part of this long story is it does not need the HPCM2 module replacement this time, or does it?

This is the sort of 'Trouble Shooting' you'd expect from a shade tree repair shop, NOT from the Manufacturer's Dealership repair shop.

I am not approving this $800 charge at the moment.
Especially if it does not fix the problem, I am still stuck with paying for this little experiment.

Is this really how it's done in this day and age of modern EV's????

 

[MrDRMorgan]

UPDATE:

It appears the state of the art trouble shooting is to tell the customer they want to 'Try' an airbag module replacement this time,
even though it is not part of the Power Train, it can take out the Power Train and they charge the customer $800 even if it does not fix the problem.

There is a 2 yr. warranty on this airbag module but the service manager is being cagey about if it goes bad immediately the next time the car is charge at a DCFC unit will it be covered.

And then if it goes bad what's the next part they want to throw at it.
They tell me 'This is at the top of the 'Trouble Tree' and we don't have a next step'....

And part of this long story is it does not need the HPCM2 module replacement this time, or does it?

This is the sort of 'Trouble Shooting' you'd expect from a shade tree repair shop, NOT from the Manufacturer's Dealership repair shop.

I am not approving this $800 charge at the moment.
Especially if it does not fix the problem, I am still stuck with paying for this little experiment.

Is this really how it's done in this day and age of modern EV's????

I would argue that a component not related to the propulsion system, like an airbag module that kills the car, should be covered under the electric propulsion warranty.